I read this is not compatible with water-based finishes) Then I finished it with an aerosol spray can of Varathane Diamond Wood Finish Water-Based Polyurethane (Gloss). We have created these special content collections organized to give you a deep dive into a range of topics that matter. Rubbing Out By Hand Using Traditional Materials In this article I’ll show you how it applies here to a polyurethane wood finishes — either oil-based or water based. When the finish hardens, you have to sand them out and apply a new finish. Water-base finishes must be applied with synthetic bristles. This is a water-based spray lacquer that performs like traditional lacquer. Rubbing out a finish is the last step in finishing. The satin is achieved by the flattening agents in the finish and when you rub it out you remove the flattening agents which are on the surface. Am I on the right track? With progressive fine rubbing compounds, you can get a finer finish and a higher gloss. It is resistant to water, alcohol, household chemicals, scratching, chipping, and wear. The smooth, clear look that you see on expensive furniture and high-end musical instruments, such as pianos and guitars, is achieved by rubbing out the finish. It looks dry to me, you need more coats if you want uniform shine. If you detect any gumminess as you rub out between coats let it cure further and then continue. Most of the time, you have to “finish the finish”. Keep applying more coats with light sanding between coats and it will smooth out. Brush out bubbles in a fresh polyurethane finish. Subscribe today, now up to 64% off newsstand. Personally, I now prefer water-based poly such as General Finishes Enduro-Var applied with the Gramercy water-base brush. 11. Take it to a high enough grit and you’ll be polishing the surface to a super high gloss. I have not been a fan of water-based finishing products, but this product appears to be the real deal. Repeat 4 or so times. Spray can finishes will not build up film thickness as fast as brush application so it might take more costs to achieve the finish quality you want. Natural bristles will absorb the water and swell up. UNLIMITED Membership is like taking a master class in woodworking for less than $10 a month. If you want you can use water, oil or wool lube as a lubricant to make the rubbing easier. I was considering wet sanding with 600 grit wet-dry sandpaper. Make Fine Woodworking a part of your holiday. Quick Tip! It is a panel of pine boards glued together. What kind of finish is it? Some water-based products bond, or melt-in, between coats while others simply lay one coat on top of the next. The point is to remove ... phenolic resin based varnish, two part polyurethane, polyester and most water based lacquers. Enter now for your chance to win more than $2,000 worth of woodworking equipment from Woodpeckers. Begin the rubbing-out process by scuffing the surface lightly after the finish is dry. Using Mirka Royal Micro sandpaper, always start with 1500-grit sandpaper. Finishes that are soft, or tough and flexible can be rubbed out, but they don't always take a uniform sheen and … Rubbing out a poly finish can be done, but as you suspect, there's a hazard built in because of the difference in the finish. The finish really needs to be applied and left alone. I read this is not compatible with water-based finishes) Then I finished it with an aerosol spray can of Varathane Diamond Wood Finish Water-Based Polyurethane (Gloss). The only way to get rid of them is to apply another coat and start over. Good luck,Andy Charron. When you get to the bottom of this article, check out my video on how I used buffing techniques to get rid of scuffs and scratches on my vehicles. The second (and subsequent) coat(s) remelt the coats preceeding it, allowing the finish to flow together. Has anybody out there tried this or any other methods? But its application is demanding and aggravating. I found rubbing with the grain was fine, no need to make circles or figure eights. The site may not work properly if you don't, If you do not update your browser, we suggest you visit, Press J to jump to the feed. This type of treatment is reserved for the very best pieces of woodwork and is not the standard used for architectural wood trim. I brushed on 4 coats of water based polyurethane (hi-gloss) over a waterbased stain. For a satin finish I stop at 600.3--Rub the entire surface with 0000 steel wool. How was it applied? Rubbing Out. Fortunately rubbing to a satin finish is easier:1--Sand the surface flat so there are no ridges, brush marks, depressions, dust specks, etc. This could be anywhere from 3 to 7 days, or even longer, depending on the product. Behind the front's flowing grain lie simple and smart building strategies. Water based finishes can be a little tricky to apply. Begin rubbing-out with medium-grade, (00 steel wool equivalent) synthetic abrasive pads (Photo 4). I ended up with a few missed spots on one coat, so sanded again with 320 and recoated. Water-based finishes can be a bit difficult to rub to a high gloss, especially finishes that contain a high percentage of urethane resins. If the finish is gummy and loads up the paper in the initial leveling, it’s not dry enough. Before the 5th and final coat I sanded again with the 400 grit paper. They dry fast which means you have to apply them fast. There are several techniques by Jeff Jewitt of Homestead Finishing Products: DRY BUFF WITH MIRKA ROYAL MICRO PAPER. Using coarse steel wool helps as larger fibers will be easier to detect. Put a few more coats on, concentrating on the areas where it's most dry. Yes you can rub out a water base polyurethane but not to satin. To reveal flaws (bubbles, brush marks, etc.) A flawless surface is elusive. Become an UNLIMITED member and get it all: searchable online archive of every issue, how-to videos, Complete Illustrated Guide to Woodworking digital series, print magazine, e-newsletter, and more. You can rub out all types of film forming finishes, including shellac, lacquer, oil based varnish and polyurethane, waterbased coatings and catalyzed or conversion coatings. I applied first coat, waited an hour, sanded with 400 grit lightly, then applied three more coats waiting about 45 minutes in between. If it's well cured you should have no trouble rubbing out a polyurethane finish. Water-based polyurethane versions dry much more quickly, are a bit more self-leveling, and have less odor when applying than oil-based versions. Use a simple shopmade jig to create cabinets that stand the test of time. Do not use polyurethane or water-based acrylics because they will not adhere to shellac. Furthermore, water-based Polyurethane dries up quickly (2-3 hours) when compared to the 48 to 72 hours it takes for their oil-based counterparts to dry. If you're committed to an oil-based finish, hand rubbing with polish or wipe-on varnish is probably the most effective way to … I want the tabletop to be smoother and with a more uniform shine/smoothness. Pine is a very soft, porous wood, so it soaks up a lot of finish. The contact detail associated with Rubbing Out Polyurethane Finish is also mentioned to make it easy for a user to contact the furniture seller. Prepare the surface to be finished. The problems with water-based polyurethane are that it doesn't level out as smoothly as an oil-based finish, and it doesn't protect as well against the elements. And, most importantly, what look are you trying to create? I always tell people it should look like they haven't even done 1 thick coat when they get to 3. Soaking the brush also softens the bristles to make your application even better. Any suggestions? *How you rub out a water-based finish depends on several things. I have built a pine tabletop: http://imgur.com/a/7mtgM. The patchiness is from the finish still being soaked up by the wood. ML Campbell also sells water-based products that the pros use, but to my knowledge they only sell in large quantities. Rubbing out is nothing more than abrading the surface until it’s nice and smooth. The final step is to buff out the 2000-grit scratches with polishing compound. Plus tips, advice, and special offers from Fine Woodworking. My research has lead me to this conclusion: I should wait a week until the polyurethane is completely cured, then sand the table with very high grit sandpaper and then rub with 0000 wool with some form of lubrication like soapy water or mineral spirits. When the surface feels smooth you are ready to nib. Thank you very much for the advice! Tackcloths can be used on oil-based poly but not on water-based. Has anybody out there tried this or any other methods? New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Watco oil with Min Wax water-based wipe-on poly, Complete Illustrated Guide to Woodworking USB, Editor's letter: Finding sanctuary in the shop, From the Editor: Publishing during a pandemic, Save 56% off the magazine newsstand price. If this is the case and you cut through the top coat, you will be left with witness lines. It dries fast so you can apply three coats in a day. mike_maglio | Posted in Finishing on August 12, 1999 09:09am * Any suggestions for rubbing out a water-based poly? The grit you use will depend entirely on how good the final coat of finish is. rubbing out water based poly? Rubbing out the finish. Rubbing the Finish. ... "Rubbing out" is an abrasive process so poly will fight it. From the second you start rubbing the finish, you start to improve the surface tremendously. Rubbing the finish removes dust nibs, brush marks and other imperfections, levels the surface, and gives an even sheen. X. **Note: Use oil-based varnish over shellac. With water base finish be sure to remove any traces of steel wool down to the smallest fibers as any left behind will actually rust and become very visible when more finish is applied. Replies. Lacquer is an evaporative finish. You don't need to wait until the poly is cured, just dried. © 2021 The Taunton Press, Inc. All rights reserved. I would like to achieve a high-luster satin finish. A place where people can come to learn and share their experiences of doing, building and fixing things on their own. Most of our tabletops are finished with polyurethane varnish. I use wet/dry paper and a wood block to do this. After the glue up I hand sanded thoroughly from 120grit to 220grit. Here are some of the steps by which the customers can easily get rid of the water-based polyurethane finish: Use The Sandpaper: The customers need to start by using a 400 grit sandpaper and rubbing it vigorously all over the surface of the Polyurethane finish in … * Any suggestions for rubbing out a water-based poly? The steel wool will give you a soft, satiny shine.Just be careful when you start the sanding process that you don't cut through the top coat. Sand with medium grit sandpaper and recoat. UNLIMITED membership - Get access to it all. Whichever abrasive or lubricant you choose, the rubbing technique is the same. Use a backer block, and start standing, apply a sprinkle or two of water to keep the sanding action lubed. Prepare the polyurethane by reducing it about 10 percent with mineral spirits, unless you're using water-based polyurethane, which doesn't need thinning. Let it cure longer. Polyurethane is the modern product most often used as varnish, or clear finish, on … Using 320-grit self-lubri-cating paper or 400-grit wet-dry paper, sand just enough to remove any dust "nibs." How many coats did you apply? Rubbing out a water based poly finish. Rub to an Even, Flat Sheen. Use steam to create strong, curved parts with continuous grain. Keep applying more coats. Hope this is of some help. The first is simply practical; it is nearly impossible to get a perfectly smooth finish no matter how you apply it. I did it for the same reason you want to, to eliminate some finishing defects and give a uniform flat, smooth surface. Thinning the polyurethane makes it flow on more smoothly and reduces brush marks. You're doing it perfectly, nice thin coats is the way to go with a spray can. The key to this process is letting the finish cure. Go to a heavier grit if surface irregularities are not fully removed. Begin with a small area, make 2-3 passes, then evaluate results. Water-based finishes can be a bit difficult to rub to a high gloss, especially finishes that contain a high percentage of urethane resins. Let the brush soak until air bubbles stop coming out from the ferrule, then remove the brush and gently wring out the solvent. This is where the finish begins to come to life, taking on an attractive, flat sheen with no visible defects. a damp cloth. Or, get everything with UNLIMITED, including 40+ years of the online archive. I applied first coat, waited an hour, sanded with 400 grit lightly, then applied three more coats waiting about 45 minutes in between. Finish with 1500-grit paper. Reply. In general terms, the longer you let a water-based finish cure, the easier it will be to rub out (within reason, of course). The sandpaper is soaked in water for 5 minutes or so prior to sanding. Stop sooner at a lower grit and you can achieve the perfect semi-gloss, satin, or matte finish. (ie--satin, gloss or a really high "piano finish" gloss?) Rub to a Satin Sheen. Shellac, solvent and water-based lacquers and two part finishes should cure at least a week. Our biweekly podcast allows editors, authors, and special guests to answer your woodworking questions and connect with the online woodworking community. In general terms, the longer you let a water-based finish cure, the easier it will be to rub out (within reason, of course). The longer you wait the better. Soak your brush in water(for water-based polyurethane) or mineral oils (for oil-based polyurethane). Though, after application, one needs nothing less than three coats to achieve a perfect finish for water-based liquid, that’s not the case with the latter. I was considering wet sanding with 600 grit wet-dry sandpaper. On the downside, water-based poly tends to raise the grain of the wood, is susceptible to watermarks, and can be … *Andy, I'm putting a finish on a desk I recently made. I would like to help but need to no more.Andy Charron. Clark Kellogg shows you how to make your own metal hardware using many of the tools you already own, plus a handful of others. And don’t drag the brush on the edge of the can. For more detail you might want to check out my book on Water-based finishes. ⚛ The information about Rubbing Out Polyurethane Finish 7 Easy Steps To Rub is completely presented here. In reality, simply applying a few coats of clear finish and waiting for them to dry rarely leads to a smooth, consistent look. 2--Continue sanding with progressivly finer grits. 10. There are three strong reasons for doing so. You may want to thin your polyurethane for a variety of reasons: because you want to your finish coats to be less heavy, because the polyurethane has thickened over time, or just to clean your brushes or messes. After finishing the 2000 grit pass, rinse off and let dry. *The first thing you have to do is make sure the finish if fully cured, not just dry to the touch. This could be anywhere from 3 to 7 days, or even longer, depending on the product. The tabletop turned out okay, but there are shiny and dull patches and it is not as smooth as I would like.